European Finals.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:47 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:15 pm
All right, Owen.
The pace of the game is slower so I don’t think you need same level or protection but more crucially we need someone in midfield to get on the ball and dictate the game. Who would you ask to do that job?

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Prufrock » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:15 pm

Mount. One of Rice or Phillips. Grealish at 10. Foden left. Sancho right.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:34 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:15 pm
Mount. One of Rice or Phillips. Grealish at 10. Foden left. Sancho right.
It’s not exactly different to what I was proposing. Foden needs players round him. Players who pass and move. Because he’s not a winger so if he plays from the left he needs licence to come inside and drift as he does for Citt and intelligent players round him.

The lack of movement in most England players bar Sterling and Foden is shocking it really is. Play like statues compared to Italy. Foden and Sterling make great runs but aren’t picked out because everyone wants to go sideways. Personally I think Sterling has been one of our better players who looks capable at this level of at least understanding the game. The weakness is midfield and how we are unable to play through it. Foden and Kane and Sterling all require the midfield to start showing the sort of one touch incisive passing they are more used to especially the City lads. Basically we need to start playing like Italy to suit what we have up front. Or stick DCL up there and just lump it like we did against Scotland.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Prufrock » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:40 pm

Grelaish as a deeper midfielder is insane.

And Sterling was awful again last night, as he has been for 6 months+.

Everything slows down through him because he's got Sarcevic's first touch. On another wavelength to the rest of them.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by TANGODANCER » Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:59 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:15 pm
Mount. One of Rice or Phillips. Grealish at 10. Foden left. Sancho right.
A view: I like Maguire's aggression, and get Walker back at right back. He has faults, who doesn't, but he'll attack and not just treat the ball like a live Mills bomb. If we get through, sooner or later we'll be playing the "pass the parcel" boys and laying off them is just asking for big trouble. That's what I couldn't understand last night; playing at home in a much cooler clime and we strolled about like a Spanish holiday paseo bunch. We need to up the pace more than a little.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:13 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 1:40 pm
Grelaish as a deeper midfielder is insane.

And Sterling was awful again last night, as he has been for 6 months+.

Everything slows down through him because he's got Sarcevic's first touch. On another wavelength to the rest of them.
You need one midfield player to screen the back four and one who can get on the ball and make things happen. Grealish picks the ball up off Villa’s centre halves. That’s what is needed. Either him or Mount doing it but Grealish is a ball carrier too.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Prufrock » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:13 pm

I think we'll see Maguire back in the next game. Possibly Henderson too.

Right back we have lots of depth. Don't think James did much to strengthen or weaken his case last night.

I'd go Trippier but wouldn't be devastated if it was walker. As long as there's a left back at left back. I'd go Chilwell, but wouldn't be devastated if it was Shaw
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:56 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:13 pm
I think we'll see Maguire back in the next game. Possibly Henderson too.

Right back we have lots of depth. Don't think James did much to strengthen or weaken his case last night.

I'd go Trippier but wouldn't be devastated if it was walker. As long as there's a left back at left back. I'd go Chilwell, but wouldn't be devastated if it was Shaw
Mings has played well - better than I expected. The problems really are all in midfield. Though don’t rate Shaw myself. I think he’s pretty average at all he does.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Prufrock » Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:00 pm

I think Chilwell is better but Shaw has been really good for United all season.

I think Mings has been fine. But he hasn't really been tested and he's really poor on the ball. I agree that Rice and Phillips didn't show enough last night but Mount kept finding pockets but Mings and Stones looked too scared to make a mistake. True for most of them tbf. And I think that comes from the manager.

Even if Sterling hadn't been awful, which he was, why wouldn't you mix it up when you have 5 subs and the attacking quality we have in wide areas. Pathetic.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:12 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:00 pm
I think Chilwell is better but Shaw has been really good for United all season.

I think Mings has been fine. But he hasn't really been tested and he's really poor on the ball. I agree that Rice and Phillips didn't show enough last night but Mount kept finding pockets but Mings and Stones looked too scared to make a mistake. True for most of them tbf. And I think that comes from the manager.

Even if Sterling hadn't been awful, which he was, why wouldn't you mix it up when you have 5 subs and the attacking quality we have in wide areas. Pathetic.
The centre halves had the ball and looked for a midfielder to take it off them to play through the lines. Which midfield player is going to do that? This is my problem. It’s not the centre halves it’s that the centre of midfield were cowards who hid and literally shirked what a midfield player at this level must do. The midfield set the tone and tempo of the game. If they literally are hiding from the ball and being screamed at by centre halves then they are the problem. And it needs sorting. If you want to play in the centre of an England midfield you have to want the ball and play quickly and forward. That’s the bare minimum. You can pick any two centre backs you want it won’t change the problems in that England side. Someone needs to dictate play and make things happen. Who is going to do that? I keep asking this question. Who?

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Bruce Rioja » Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:45 pm

Dare I offer, amongst the pitchforks, that Scotland actually deserve credit? Resolute and incredibly well organised when defending, swift and effective on the counter. Shite up top though, as I said earlier. 0-0 was a very fair result, I think.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:48 pm

Bruce Rioja wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:45 pm
Dare I offer, amongst the pitchforks, that Scotland actually deserve credit? Resolute and incredibly well organised when defending, swift and effective on the counter. Shite up top though, as I said earlier. 0-0 was a very fair result, I think.
Yeah Scotland played well. I don’t think they were hanging on though. They were the better side and more likely to win it.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Worthy4England » Sat Jun 19, 2021 4:05 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:48 pm
Bruce Rioja wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:45 pm
Dare I offer, amongst the pitchforks, that Scotland actually deserve credit? Resolute and incredibly well organised when defending, swift and effective on the counter. Shite up top though, as I said earlier. 0-0 was a very fair result, I think.
Yeah Scotland played well. I don’t think they were hanging on though. They were the better side and more likely to win it.
Well, if they want to celebrate no wins, no goals and being bottom of their league, who am I to argue?

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Hoboh » Sat Jun 19, 2021 5:01 pm

You could debate this all day but not take away the fact Engand are just poor. The number of times our blinkered centre backs kept passing out to the right down blind alleys when players were free on the left is unbelievable, no movement and our forwards are so off form as to be a waste of space. Win it, dream on.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 5:48 pm

Portugal, Germany game is great. Two teams packed full of great players.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Hoboh » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:00 pm

BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 5:48 pm
Portugal, Germany game is great. Two teams packed full of great players.
Agreed, Ronaldo still can shift a bit still but I get the feeling the Germans might just March on now.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:11 pm

Hoboh wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:00 pm
BWFC_Insane wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 5:48 pm
Portugal, Germany game is great. Two teams packed full of great players.
Agreed, Ronaldo still can shift a bit still but I get the feeling the Germans might just March on now.
That German third, all quick one touch stuff to set up the cross and then movement in the middle. It’s absolutely light years away from the stodge we watched last night.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Prufrock » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:21 pm

Ok Germany are not very bad. Repeat, *not* very bad.

Abort, abort.
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Re: European Finals.

Post by BWFC_Insane » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:31 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:21 pm
Ok Germany are not very bad. Repeat, *not* very bad.

Abort, abort.
No idea when looking at players why anyone wouldn’t rate the German potential. Outstanding group. Italy, Germany, France or Belgium - hard to look past one of these four in terms of their quality and what we’ve seen so far. Not seeing many dark horses.

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Re: European Finals.

Post by Worthy4England » Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:52 pm

Prufrock wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 6:21 pm
Ok Germany are not very bad. Repeat, *not* very bad.

Abort, abort.
I shall say nothing at this juncture.

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